Wow, what a bad display. I can't speak for the LAK@DAL game, but SJ@NYR and VAN@EDM, man o man..... the refs were terrible.
How could the ref miss the slash on Sedin at the end when it was right in front of him?
How could the ref be looking at the crease from behind the net, and not see the loose puck laying there and whistles the play dead before the Rangers score?
I mean, bad calls one by one tonight. What a horrible showing by the refs. This is not to excuse the Canucks or Rangers. By all means, Edmonton got called on marginal penalties and the Nucks had a lot of chances but failed. Rangers had a lot of chances and could not bury them, plus i don't even know why Torts played Valiquette when Lundqvist has been hot. Vali's glove was a horror show tonight.
Still, bad refereeing can change the game a lot. Would Vancouver have scored on the PP in the last two minutes of the game with a six on four? Maybe. Would the Rangers have won had the ref counted the goal where the Rangers would later have a 3-0 lead?
Horrible. I am still shocked at the slash on Sedin, though. I mean........wow........, the ref was looking at Sedin and Hemsky. Seriously............ these are horrible errors by the refs and they need to be held accountable.
Horrible.
Posted on 10/19 10:18 PM | IP: 98.77.176.69
The slash on Sedin looked worse than it was, caught him above the glove, but it should have been called. That would be an amazing coincidence to have the twins both on IR.
Rypien is a new favourite, love the way he manhandled Stortini and showed a lot of fire on his shifts.
Henrik looks like he's on autopilot without Daniel.
Grabner will need to show a bit more grit below the goal line to keep his spot. I'm not really seeing much spark there, and I would rather Bernier move up to the 2nd line to at least put traffic in front, seek the puck down low.
Rumour says Horton is on the block. How about Schneider to FLO?
Posted on 10/20 12:17 AM | IP: 154.20.102.208
I normally do not comment on your bad officiating threads.......but I will this time. I agree 100% that the Rangers were the victim of bad refing on the goal that was whistled dead in front of the SJ net. What on god's green earth was the ref doing behind the net? I know he wants to see if the puck is crossing the line but that is what you have a goal judge for no? His positioning on that play was in such a bad manor that he had to blow the whistle dead as it was impossible for him to see the loose puck in front of the SJ Net. The ref must of thought he was Gretzky or something.
Posted on 10/20 5:54 AM | IP: 64.231.213.113
The Nucks couldn't score - they had their chances and outplayed Edmonton - they just couldn't put the puck in the net.
They aren't getting screens set up and aren't getting their point shots through - as a result most of their shots are easy for the goalie to see. Until they start working harder they won't win many games.
Injuries are an excuse but they happen to all teams - they need to start scoring to start winning, whether Daniel, Demitra and Salo are in the lineup or not.
Posted on 10/20 6:00 AM | IP: 203.18.176.243
I didn't see the SJ/NYR game but I agree with your assessment on the Nucks/Oil game. Tom Kowal is a local boy that I've know since he was in my school. I got a bench minor from him when I was coaching Bantam. He didn't call an obvious slash and I stood on the top of the boards at the corner of the players' bench and yelled at him. Apparently Refs don't like that. I'll give Tom credit as he only gave me a minor rather than throwing me out and admitted privately that he had blown the call. After that, all I had to do was point to the corner of the bench when I disagreed with a call and I'd get a chuckle out of him.
Just so you know Tom, I'm pointing at the corner right now.
Posted on 10/20 8:20 AM | IP: 24.71.45.246
Unfortunately, only an idiot like Garrioch would say that Horton is on the block, and you have no idea how many times i have corrected Eklund saying that Horton is talked around the league.
I already knew he wasn't, and i like that Sexton interacts with the media as he was pissed off about the rumor and killed it entirely by saying not even a call was made to him about Horts. That is because every league knows that he is not being shopped.
Anyway, Schneider for Horton? Why? Panthers have Vokoun, Clemmensen, and Markstrom.
As for the slash...........it was bad, regardless how it looked, it was right in front of the ref and he did not call it. There's just no excuse for it. I mean, i am happy the Oilers won, but if i were AV i would have been steaming about it, yelling at the ref "WHAT DID YOU SEE? WHAT DID YOU SEE?"
Ridiculous.
Posted on 10/20 8:42 AM | IP: 98.77.176.69
you're right DH,
they are not getting the dirty goals...sure lots of shots, but without getting in there hitting, causing trouble - goalies in this league stop most of the shots directed at them. it may seem like their best game, but i didnt like the "feel" of it. this team is not playing hard interms of desire and paying the price. look at the hit counter - almost zilch - this is NOT the team i envisioned so far,despite the excuse of injuries. none of the "physical guys are injured.
funny about the call, i though the interference on Burrows before the sedin slash was even worse - literally caused a goal taken away as the puck came to him after that, and his stick was tossed out by the defender after the interference. oh well, van better smarten up. at least it looks like wellwood finally woke up.
Posted on 10/20 9:53 AM | IP: 96.49.79.153
So Sedin is in cruise control?
Big week in one of the hockey pools Im in and Vancouver has 5 games next week so I was debating on taking Henrik.....Im might have to re-consider.
When is Daniel back? Who is taking his spot? Do you think Henrik will continue to coast?
these are the questions IM asking my Vancouver brothers to answer......
Posted on 10/20 12:46 PM | IP: 64.231.213.113
Henrik has been fine - quite good actually - he just has a downgrade on his wing from Daniel to Samuelsson.
He's still a good player to pick up IMHO - he'll get a point a game most of the time and he's playing a ton of PP minutes.
Posted on 10/20 1:01 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
I'd stay away in the meantime, Daniel is back in maybe three weeks. Henrik looks lost and isn't dishing the puck in any resemblance to the first few games . . . they dominated and looked like 95-100 point guys.
They'll get some goals on that line - Samuelsson is good but a 40-point guy at the most. AV should consider retooling the lineup a bit, experiment with combinations and see what shakes out. It's too early to panic, but they will need to start potting a few.
Posted on 10/20 1:30 PM | IP: 154.20.102.208
samuelsson will get 50pts when demitra is back. when daniel is back with henrik, lots of pressure will fall off the 2nd line.
team's just missing too many skilled players - salo, schnieder, sedin, demitra - aint' easy to replace. imagine calgary without regher, giordano, iginla and langkow. no team has the depth to take this kind of hit.
henrik has been fine...it's the powerplay that's taken he biggest hit.
Posted on 10/20 1:43 PM | IP: 96.49.79.153
After watching so many one-sided officiated games during the Messier era vs the Sharks all I can say is it is about time they got a break against NY.......
Posted on 10/20 1:47 PM | IP: 192.146.217.50
Vokoun is 33, Clemmensen is a career backup and short term fix, and I think Schneider is an upgrade on Markstrom from what I can tell, although Schneider seems to have trouble making the final step to the NHL game.
I'm sure Horton is safe, but he's the kind of rugged winger the Nucks could use . . . beyond Daniel and Demitra, they don't have many natural and 'proven' goal scorers. Come trading deadline Schneider's a chip they should cash in.
Posted on 10/20 1:54 PM | IP: 154.20.102.208
Henrik and Daniel are their own PP even 5 on 5! I agree he's skating well, creating chances, but he's nowhere near as dominating as before. Losing those guys shows the lack of depth with scoring. I said it elsewhere, Schneider(G)should be shopped at the deadline for top-six scoring or a blue chip winger.
Posted on 10/20 2:01 PM | IP: 154.20.102.208
Hi Frites,
I am afraid that is expecting far more return for Schneider than is realistic given his record to date. He has proven himself at the AHL but not at the NHL. We tend to over rate his value now based on what we expect him to become. I have no doubt that Schneider will be a strong goal tender in the NHL but to expect a team to trade for him this year with that kind of return going to Vancouver isn't likely to happen.
What I could see is Schneider going as part of a package and that could well happen given their current lack of success. Unfortunately, Schneider likely wouldn't be the key component in a major trade. Names like Bieksa and Kessler are the ones who usually get mentioned and, personally, I don't want to see either of them moved.
Our best bets for a top six forward are currently on our injured reserve list. Sedin and Demitra, when healthy, are critical to our success this year. The Canucks have to stay within range of the top eight teams with their current depleted roster. If they can do that, they will be fine. The same team with Sedin, Demitra, Salo and Schneider added removes the need for a trade forgoing our future.
Posted on 10/20 3:35 PM | IP: 24.71.45.246
Vokoun is 33, and? Khabi is still in tops and is quite older. Clemmensen is a solid back-up that proved he can play many games at the NHL level. And what indicates that Schneider is better than Markstrom? Nothing.
I like Schneider, don't get me wrong, i wanted him in the Luongo deal, but he is not what the Panthers need, at all.
Posted on 10/20 9:09 PM | IP: 98.77.176.69
I agre with Peroni - why would the Panthers want Schneider? They've got other holes to fill.
The Nucks will trade Schneider to a team that needs a goalie - Philly, Chicago, maybe Toronto (depending on Monster) - but the Panthers have an A prospect in Markstrom who is playing OK for a young guy in Sweden.
Posted on 10/21 7:10 AM | IP: 203.18.176.243
sorry to interrupt...but that's well said Sir.
we all over rate our prospects or expect too much too early. Schneider will be good, but it'll take a while. so his trade value is marginal i believe.
as for Bieksa - gosh, i'm getting a little tired of him - his lackadaisical play and boneheaded positioning is often the most untimely. he's an easy guy to love cuz he looks tough and gets some points. but at the end of the day - he's not terribly physical in terms of actual play. he makes almost 4mill per - so he's not cheap coin either. i'd move him in a pkg for a bonafide center/scorer if Salo wasnt such a regular IR mess. i knew we would miss Ohlund - despite slower legs, always solid positionally, and our MOST physical defenceman - we all assumed he'd be easily replaced (not me). now the only guy who throws hits is Obrien and mr. dumbpenalty doesnt even do that all that regularly.
anyhow, i dont care really where the nucks finish - just make the darn playoffs. you've got to beat everyone to win the cup anyways, so there is no easy road. i feel another loss tonite, so i guess we'll hear the radio blues again in vancouver. this team will be different once the IR guys return altho i'd still like Gillis to address some of the toughness issue with our play. we've become a perimeter team again.
Posted on 10/21 9:49 AM | IP: 96.49.79.153
Hi Beast,
Isn't it strange how our expectations have undergone such a severe revision in so short a time? Going in to the season, being in the playoffs was just "assumed". Now it's something to be hoped for. Calgary is pulling away from us and by beating teams like Columbus decisively, convinces me that they aren't doing it with smoke and mirrors. The Canucks have helped to make other teams appear far stronger than they really are. Does anyone really expect Colorado to be at or near the top by year end? What's worse is when you look at some of the other teams playing below expectations and realize that isn't going to last either. The Canucks have to turn this around and quick or the entire process will be set back a full season at least. The panic mongers in Vancouver are already crying for Gillis to blow this team up. That's complete over reaction in my opinion. Will they be a team capable of making up so much ground (or in this case, ice) when they get healthy or will the pack remain too far out of reach? The only things going for them is that there is a lot of time left in the season and other teams are also starting to face some key injuries. On the negative side, the Canucks don't have any clear timeline for players like Sedin and Demitra to return and they also have a very difficult schedule awaiting them. We have to begin preparing ourselves for some disappointment.
Posted on 10/21 10:36 AM | IP: 24.71.45.246
Thanks for the advice (everyone) To bad Beast would not take a side I would have had a tie breaker!
Die Hard in the okay camp Frites in the no camp (temporarily)
My gut tells me that Henrick is not going to produce a could clip of points over the next 5 games. I think the losses of Demietra, Salo, and Daniel will cause Henrik to be checked harder then normal as there is now only one line to focus on. I believe that when the Nucks loose one of the two twins it is akin to loosing a player in a half as the symetry between the two exceeds the individual parts. I also think that 5 games in 7 nights is going to be grueling for anyone.
Posted on 10/21 10:38 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
I think the turn around solely depends on Luongo. He has not been himself yet this year. Looked better of late but he is the leader on the Vancouver team and he is going to be desperately needed.
Luongo returns to form and go .500 while the players heal to health and Vancouver will be okay. Secondly Kessel and Burrows do not look the same this year and are not near as nasty as last year.
Overall Luongo not at full stride Kessel, Burrows: Need to get back to last years play. Get Healthy: and take what is now a below average forward group and go back to above average will do wonders as well.
The three keys........out of the three Luongo looks improved of late and he is the biggest of the three. Kessel and Burrows I believe are suffering from we are a playoff contender and are not playing the same way. That should change with some prodding.
Healthy will hopefully improve on its own and the team can squeek out a way to go .500 in the meantime.
Posted on 10/21 10:46 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
hey SR,
well, you know, w'ere 3-5, not 0-7. it's really not that bad when all things are considered. there's really 3 mini seasons in the 80+ game schedule - 1st 20-25 games, the xmas run (2nd half), post trade deadline (where pittsburgh took off last year). in each section teams get assessed, coaches get fired, and players used to get traded (doesnt happen much now). but it's like a re-start for a team at the beginnings of those intervals.
van had a shabby start last year too, and it wasnt until after xmas did this team start to wake up, and it was a new season altogether. so really, there's no reason to blow this team up. those 4 guys we're missing are huge, and others have to step up,and so far nobody has. louie's regular october blues certainly dont help considering he's our number one guy - he's got to be better, and in the last 2 games i think he has.
i think this is why i'm starting to get really irritated with injury prone players like demitra and salo. it' messes with your game plan day in day out, and limits the options for the GM. Salo was Nonis's mistake, Demitra Gillis'. what i'm hoping for now is that Daniel and Schneider return soon, and that alone will boost our offensive woes. take away that mtl drubbing, and we've been pathetic on the score sheet.
on the plus side, november is usually when Louie turns it around and he can win games single handed. by that time we should also get a clearer picture on demitra and salo, and perhaps Gillis can make the right move at such time should the need/options arrive. like you i dont think LA, phoenix, edm, colorado or columbus will stay anywhere near where they are. on the negative side, a team like St. louis is also better than where they stand. van has time, but they better start righting this ship soon - with hard work, scoring dirty ugly goals and more timely goaltending. the season is long, but there is also screwball factor that is the olympics being here in vancouver.
Posted on 10/21 11:30 AM | IP: 96.49.79.153
hey shakes!
you should know i wouldnt be able to tip you off! haha anyhow, i think your instincts are correct - unless samuelsson suddenly becomes a sedin, henrik wont average pt/game as usual. mind you sammy has played well, but burrows has not altho not from a lack of trying.
5 games in 7 night IS grueling. i fear tonite, is gonna be another flop unless Louie stands on his head. Chicago has far too much fire power for this non-physical team at the momemt. i hope they prove me wrong and get some grit back.
Posted on 10/21 11:37 AM | IP: 96.49.79.153
Hi Shakes,
Maybe you've heard about a Canuck/Leaf trade that I hadn't or you mean Kessler. ;-)
Part of the problem with both Kessler and Burrows is the frequent alteration of their linemates. The chemistry that Burrows had with the twins was close to returning to last season form when Daniel got hurt. Since that time, Vigneault has done a lot of line juggling trying to get some offense from both of the top lines without much success. Personally, I would rather see some consistency rather than musical chairs. If Burrows is no longer the answer with Henrik and Samuelsson then put Grabner or Bernier or whomever with them as a stop gap measure and leave them there. I don't see any of these being an improvement but at least then you would have Burrows and Kessler reunited to provide a second line pairing and with Raymond rounding into similar form, that could provide the secondary scoring they are so desperate for. I don't have a problem with the Samuelsson/Sedin combination even after Daniel returns but until he does, there hasn't been the same level of effectiveness from that first line and that has made the difference in recent games, against Edmonton in particular.
I really don't know where Demitra will fit in, assuming he comes back close to 100%. Possibly the third line but given the past history, the second line is more likely. If I were making the assignments, I would go with: The twins with Samuelsson Kessler with Burrows and Raymond Wellwood with Demitra and Bernier or Grabner Johnson with Rypien and Hansen
But then, they're not paying me the big bucks.
Take care.
Posted on 10/21 12:51 PM | IP: 24.71.45.246
You could be right Shakes - he could not be great - but in his last 4 games without Daniel he's got 5 points.
If he's playing 5 games next week I definitely pick him up - he'll be just fine.
Posted on 10/21 2:15 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
The problem is that the "Sedin's" are so consistant that you wonder when that will change. In this case because of an injury to one.
Im going to take a another boo at the schedule and see if any of the games are against some of the worst defensive teams in the NHL. I know the game on Saturday is against Toronto so there is one team that sucks....(LOL!) Although I must admit I dont think it will be a blow out game.....Toronto is playing better then there record would indicate and goaltending has been the biggest factor in at least 33% of there loses.......although from the sounds of it niether Toskala or the Monster are ready to start yet. So it could be a blow out. Believe it or not hockey is one of the hardest sports to predict.
Posted on 10/21 4:07 PM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Line changes do not help but when your not winning that is what happens. You keep juggling and juggling to find that right mix that might work. You know who I thought played well the last few games was Rypien. He is getting his nose dirty and doing a good job and playing the way "KESSLER" and Burrows should play....
You mean that the Leafs traded two first round picks for Kessler???? When did this happen! Why wasn't I informed!
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