To watch shot after shot hit cross bars, goal posts, and to decidely out play the opponent in the last 6 games and yet at the end of the day end up with 6 points, 1 win with 4 overtime/shootout losses is hard to take. Exciting as heck to watch but at the same time you have to wonder when there luck is going to change........
To watch Kessel get what a 100 quality shots on net in his debut last night to only see the puck dance around the goal line/hit the cross bar/slide through the goalie's legs without going in was fun but the novelty is soon going to where off.. The hockey gods are not helping one single solitary bit.
Oh well my rant is over I feel better.........(no not really but I will tell myself that)
FYI Kessel looks very good, exceptionally good and as discussed earlier the guy is a shooter who can skate which is a rarity. One thing he is exceptionally good at is shooting pucks threw defenders legs and or around them. This gives him a good screen to the net and with his quick release the pucks will start to go in the net real soon. The talent of being able to shoot threw or around defenders legs as screens in tight corners is something that is not easily learned. You have to have a sense of how to do it and the right type of release to make it effective + practice it a ton in order to be really good at it. Not many players can master this skill. Kessel has mastered it and is exceptional at it and this is one of the reasons why he still can score goals in the playoff's where other shooters and fast skaters get checked. The release is to quick and the ability to shoot through blocks is a talent onto itself. Very difficult skill to master with a hard shot to boot.
If Kessel can play half as good as he did last night in multiple games for the Leafs this year and score goals the Leafs did alright on this deal.....
Posted on 11/4 6:27 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Every team goes through some bad luck, but when you are given chance after chance, especially on PPs, like the Leafs have gotten, you gotta capitalize.
The difference between the Rangers and Nucks last night? Rangers did not capitalize on chances, Nucks did.
Still, i think the Leafs are closing in on better days. They look much sharper, faster, alert, focused, and Gusty is good enough to give them a chance to win. If i were a Leafs fan, i wouldn't be as worried as i was a couple of weeks ago. Things are looking better for the Leafs.
Posted on 11/4 7:22 AM | IP: 98.77.12.40
Im not worried.....they have been playing good. They just have not been able to get the monkey off of there back and string a few games together like they deserved to.
Monster's Save percentage has improved to .903 vs. the team average of .86? something which is a big improvement and it looks like it is only going to get better.
Teams PK is starting to improve.
Teams willingness and ability to get points in games where they are trailing is actually pretty good.
I just witnessed a ton of bad breaks over the last 5 games where extra points were deserved and not gotten. You have to wonder when the team will take a few nights off and then be in a real pickle as a result.
Posted on 11/4 8:09 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Consider yourself lucky - at least you have players on the ice - Vancouver has 7 forwards out and has lost 82 man games to injury in the first 16 games of this season - they had 209 man games lost all last year.
The fact they are winning is a testament to their depth and solid coaching.
The Leafs will struggle no matter what happens - opponents are starting to take them lightly which means they won't put in their best effort against them. Unfortunately the Leafs don't have the skill players to make teams pay - Kessel is a good start in the right direction but they need a few more drivers and fewer passengers.
Posted on 11/4 9:42 AM | IP: 203.18.176.243
Vancouver is winining in a large part as a result of rock solid goaltending. It actually pains me to see Razor play so well in Van land after stinking out the joint in Toronto. If he played anywhere near what he played like in Toronto Van would be in a lot of trouble.....IMHO
That said I do credit the Vancouver team for playing well inspite of injuries......and I do credit the play of Samuelson for stepping into big shoes and doing okay along with the second and third liners for picking up the slack.
I think your wrong on the teams taking the Leafs lightly and it is a cop out comment. I do not really see to many teams taking them lightly in the first 12 games of the season when everyone is still fresh. Making the playoff's is a grind and nobody wants to be behind the 8 ball before Christmas...... Montreal, Dallas, and Buffalo all played spirited games against them as they realized that they really needed the 2 points in the bank. Vancouver was the only team in the last 6 games that took them lightly, and perhaps so did the Ducks/penalty wise....Did the Leafs want to win more then some of there opposition recently? Absolutely they were hungrier...... But that said Montreal was hungry, Buffalo was hungry, and so was Dallas.......Tampa was typical tampa playing lazy mans hockey......So in the last 6 games the only team that took them lightly in my opinion was Vancouver....Totally disagree teams are taking them lightly but I guess we will see.......
Posted on 11/4 10:43 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
You might be right Shakes - I'm not in the opposing dressing rooms - what do you think is the Leafs problem then? Lack of skill and talent? Just bad luck? I don't believe in the latter over longer periods of time and the Leafs have played a number of games so it can't be that.
I'd say that Monster in net full time is a step in the right direction - the D is looking better but the forwards look awful. When a guy like Kessel is head and shoulders above the rest of them and hasn't played in 6 months you know you're in trouble.
Posted on 11/4 1:27 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
I think the goaltending stank out of the gate (first 8 games or so - the one game Gustavson played in being the exception) + they got horrible defensive coverage in multiple games to start the year as well. Not a good combination (bad goaltending + defenders looking stupid). That covers the first 8 games.......Everyone with half a brain knew Toskala was not playing well out of training camp so it was no suprise that he consistantly let in a soft goal per game in the reg season.
Then the Leafs finally got decent goaltending against Vancouver by there third stringer and decent defensive coverage and Luongo decided to steal a game for Van. (hey that happens and that is Luongo's job)
Next 5 games the Leafs go .500" but deserve to win all 5 games.....(only game that was close to a toss up was Buff vs. Toronto) the rest of the games the opponents were out played. At the end of the day overtime and shootouts resulted in 0 points for the leafs in 5 attempts this year.....that is a bad record when you did not even deserve to be in overtime in the first place.
It would be easy to say it was the forwards lack of scoring but that was not always the case as in some games that one weak goal was given up by Toronto where as the opposing goalie always seemed to make that one great save yet give up no weak goals. That is a 2 goal spread that is hard to overcome.....seems to be resolving itself lately as the Monster looks good but even he made a rookie mistake last night that gave a absolutely lifeless Tampa team a gift goal....
When the gift goals stop toronto will be fine.....
Posted on 11/4 2:36 PM | IP: 76.75.95.232
The Toskala situation reminds me of something that I saw personally a couple of weeks ago. As I have mentioned before, my daughter is an elite lacrosse goalie, she recently played in a tournament at UC Davis with a wild card team and did not look the same as she had the past few months. Admittedly she was not practicing as much as summer, and I thought that that was the issue, but when I spoke with her coach he told me that he was sure her game was off because she had no confidence in her defense. My guess is that is where Toskala is, he has been "shell-shocked" by the Leafs "defense." When he was with SJ many thought he was better than Nabokov, btw. As for my daughter, we will find out this weekend at the St. Marys Tournment......just a few thoughts from the left coast.....
Posted on 11/4 3:42 PM | IP: 192.146.217.50
They will be OK now that they got their H1N1 shots
Posted on 11/4 4:28 PM | IP: 96.30.170.173
thanks I feel much better now. I bet you there arms hurt.
Posted on 11/5 6:16 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
The situation with your daughter reminds me of Patrick Roy with Montreal the year he was traded. Where Roy had lost confidence in the team he played for and was eventually move to Colorado and won the cup. Hopefully your daughter is in high gear for the next big tourney. Hockey like lacrosse is a team sport and good goaltending alone is not enough to win. But it goes a long way!
Toskala loosing confidence in the Leafs? I think it is the other way around. You can see it on the players faces, coaches faces, Burkes face...... whenever a questionable goal is let in by Toskala everyone grimmaces. Perhaps Toskala feels like everyone has no confidence in him??? That would be more accurate in my opinion. The Team has 3 new defenders in front of Toskala this year or a change over of 50% of there defence corp. The Team played quite good in the pre-season when Macdonald started, when the Monster started, and when Toskala started. The weakest goalie comming out of camp was Toskala who in inspite of a poor showing in training camp was given the nod as the starting goalie. That is when everything started to come un-glued. I knew that the start of the season would be a battle between the Monster and Toskala but little did I know that both starting goalies would go down with injuries at the same time so soon into the season. It is easy to blame just the goaltending in Toronto but the facts are that in the last 5 games with average to good goaltending the Leafs have went .500" and out played every team through that strech and could have easliy ran off 3-4 wins in a row vs. repetitively loosing in overtime.
I believe that with the way the Monster is playing the Leafs goaltending situation is improved and the numbers GAA and Save percentages posted by the Monster have been steadily getting better. Where the Leafs need to be better is on finishing there chances and scoring that goal that they may not deserved to score.....more capitalistic and more game breaking capabilities. The only hope is that Kessel in part can fill that role......and once again have Torotno get better in another area of the game.
Posted on 11/5 6:31 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Vancouver can be accused of playing some pretty boring hockey right now, but with all of the injuries it is what it is and if you are forced to play defencemen up front what can you expect?...
I think the Leafs and the Nucks given the rosters they currently put on the ice are very similar...
Stronger on the back end and in goal than they are up front...
I think the Leafs should be trying to win every game 2 - 1 whether it be boring or not...
That should be the identity of their team...
The worry I would have is can their smurf forwards play a gritty enough game to pull it off?...
The other worry is that when you look around the league, most of the teams at the top of the standings or power rankings have few or no key injuries while the teams at the bottom of the standings do...
in the Leafs case, they are having trouble getting wins while they have been pretty much injury free all season long, so what happens when the injury bug hits them?....
Take care...
Posted on 11/5 6:59 AM | IP: 99.199.174.104
On the back end (defence is okay) for the Leafs they have one NHL player tryiing to crack the line up Jeff Finger and another Garnersson (sp?) that was pretty good for them in the pre-season but would be a rookie. They have already lost Van Ryn for the season.....defence actually has decent depth.
Up front they still have Bozak, Stahlberg, and Hanson waiting to crack the team and some would argue that they are better then some of the players that are playing right now. If for example the Leafs loose Stajan then Bozak would take his place and the difference is not much. Where as Vancouver loosing D Sedin is much harder to replace..
All and all only 4 players would be devisating to loose injury wise.....Monster, Kaberle, Kessel and Komi. The rest of the team is not much different then the players that are waiting behind them on the Marlies. I think the difference between the Leafs and Van is that Van has some top players up front where as the Leafs have one (Kessel). I think defencemen wise the Leafs are deeper on the blueline then Vancouver is.....maybe not as much as they were before now that they lost Van Ryn but they still have some qualified options.
But yes your right with a relatively healthy team the Leafs are not making much in the way of headway. Maybe it is karma as the Leafs only a couple of seasons ago were first or second in man games lost to injury. Some good luck in this area would be nice for a change.
In order for the Leafs to start to put together a modest winning streak they need to score .5 more goals per game......and or at the same time start to stop .5 goals per game. Right now there is hope on both fronts with the insertion of Kessel on the line up in order to help score goals. Then at the same time let the Monster play all the games he can and cut down on the rookie mistakes that he has made over the last couple of games (one resulting in a penalty that caused a goal and the other on an errant pass) and you have a positive occuring on both sides of the rink.
Vs. injury concersns my immediate concern is that the team in general has put in a strong effort for 5 games in a row and I know that sooner or later they will switch it off for a few games and when that happens any postives seen in the last 5 games will be negated....and they will have to build up any confidence gained from scratch.
Win a couple in a row would be a good start for them and not outside of the possible.....This team is much better then there record but not good enough to be able to come back and string together a huge winning streak like some good teams can. They unfortunately have to outwork there opponents and earn there points the old fashioned way so when they loose games that they should have won it is a real bummer.....
Posted on 11/5 8:09 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Shakes,
I've been so busy, and wanted to post about Kessel. It was an absolute treat to watch someone wearing a Leafs sweater with that much offensive skill, and the natural ability to fire the puck. So cool.
The way he can get pucks through traffic is an art. You find him a set up man and a big guy to take out the trash, and you'll have a dynamic line.
Posted on 11/5 9:08 AM | IP: 67.161.33.19
You know what is funny I have tried to make comparisons to other Leafs with similar skills/talents but guess what there has not been any in the last 20 years. Not one good comparison.......Joe Sakic shot/release with Mogilny type moves and ability to shoot through players from the half boards except a faster skater..a little smaller mind you. But overall nobody has had that kind of talent on the Leafs in over 20 years. No wonder why Burke coveted him so much as it is very difficult to shut down those type of players with that release and agility.
Posted on 11/5 12:12 PM | IP: 76.75.95.232
I disagree (are you surprised?) that the Leafs are deeper on the back end than Vancouver for a few reasons - one is that the Leafs have a more expensive D corps than Vancouver which means they can't upgrade up front as much, two is that any team with Jeff Finger in your top 7 is not a deep team defensively, and three is that the Leafs simply give up way more opportunities than the Nucks do - and it's not all due to bad defence by the forwards.
The Nucks have just as much top end talent - Salo is injury prone but a legitimate top 2 d-man on just about any team in the NHL, Kaberle is very good offensively and just as bad defensively (he doesn't take nearly enought flak for this IMHO, he just isn't good in his own zone) - while Mitchell is one of the top shut down guys in the league. Komisarek is very good but can be exposed by the faster forwards in the league, while Willie isn't fast but has learned positioning and has one of the best sticks in the league.
Edler and Ehrhoff is a better #3/4 than White and Beauchemin, especially the way Beau is playing this year and White being so small (though White has been better than I thought he would be - I give him credit for this), and Bieksa, Schneider, SOB is miles ahead of Schenn, Finger, Exelby, it's not even close. Schenn has stalled in his development and will improve, hopefully it's just a sophomore slump because this kid should be a heck of a d-man.
The Leafs have given up 52 goals in 13 games, the Nucks 42 in 16 games - and 4 of those without Lu, while the first 3 he was as bad if not worse than Toskala (SV% in the low .800's). The Nucks have an underrated blueline, they can all play 2 ways.
There's a reason that the Nucks can lose Schneider, Salo, Luongo, Daniel, Demitra, Hansen, Wellwood, etc all for most or part of this season and still be over .500 and that's depth - the Nucks have it at forward, at D and in goal (though I wouldn't have said this before the season, Raycroft has been very good).
The Leafs have good defensive depth when compared to their forwards and goalies, but it's not great defensive depth. It's middle of the pack, the Nucks are probably 10th in the league, the Leafs probably 15th in terms of the best blueline.
This all being said - the Leafs have had some bad luck to start this season and they will be better - they won't be good, but they will be better. Van had horrible luck (and goaltending) their first few games and have really picked it up lately - it's not pretty hockey at all but it's effective and will change in a week or so when they get Lu, Daniel and Hansen back in the lineup.
Posted on 11/5 2:03 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
Who is the son of a b!tch on the team? (hehe, sorry, i couldn't contain myself).
I'm stunned by Raycroft's comeback this season. Thumbs up to him. It also puts off a lot of pressure on Luongo.
But man, the Wild have issues......
Posted on 11/5 9:48 PM | IP: 98.77.12.40
Kaberle leads the league in points by a defencemen this year and is the only defencemen in the league to average more then a point a game thus far. He plays on a team that has pourous forwards offensively and on a team that is at the bottom of the league for goals scored yet you want to compare Salo to him? Ludricous. Over 50% of the Leafs goals this year Kaberle had a point on them.....By far and away Kaberle is one of the top offensive dmen in the entire league. Salo is not. Kaberle just finshed winning player of the week honours to boot....
Me personally I do not see the point of discussing the Leafs blueline until you concede that offensively Kaberle is the best defender from both teams. FYI I just wanted to put in a cool emotioncon and I liked that one .....nothing meant by it.
Posted on 11/6 11:10 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
I did concede that Kaberle is the best offensive d-man on either team - he might also be the worst defensive d-man on either team. He is brutal in his own end, doesn't tie up sticks, doesn't play physically, doesn't stay with his man.
Salo on the other hand is not as good offensively though he's no slouch - much better shot than Kaberle who almost never shoots, Kaberle is a much better passer overall. Both are good skaters, Salo also might be the best defensive d-man on the Nucks - it's close between him and Mitchell.
As for the rest of the d-men on each team - the goals conceded by each team speak for themselves. As for points scored by the D - the Leafs d-men all combined have 7 G, 25 A for 32 points on the season. The Canucks D have 7 G, 32 A for 39 points on the season.
The Leafs are giving up 4 goals a game, the Nucks 2.6 - and it's obviously not all Luongo who hasn't even played the past 5 games. I just don't see how you compare the D men on each team - the Nucks are just as good offensively overall, they are miles better defensively (not even in the same ballpark), they have just as much size and snarl - they are just better.
Not trying to get you all worked up about how the Leafs aren't a good team Shakes - but you did make the comment that the Leaf D was deeper than the Nuck D.........
Posted on 11/6 12:26 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
I'd have to think long and hard before I was willing to concede that Kaberle is a better offensive d-man than Kaberle, and with the strong defensive play of Ehrohoff this season I would take him over Kaberle without hesitation...
Ehrhoff has been the Nucks best all around blueliner this season in my opinion...
Take care...
Posted on 11/6 12:35 PM | IP: 96.54.68.50
Kaberle is not the same player this year. He actually finally decided to lift wieghts in the off season and it shows. Much stronger this year.........and no you did not concede that Kaberle is by far and away the best offensive player on either team. If you were picking a PP quarterback for either team Kaberle would be the hands down first choice.....He would also be the first defender you wanted on the ice if you needed to score a goal hands down.
You want to analyse stats? Not the best comparison but I will take a look.
Your right the Nucks defence has more points overall then the Leafs defence does..........This clearly shows that they probably have more offensive depth then the Leafs. But they have also scored 20 more goals thus far this season......this makes no sense to me so I will analyse further.
Looking closer at your 32 points to 39 points from the blueline
The Leafs blueline has 32 points in total vs. the team total scored of 31. This means that the Leafs blueline is involved with almost all of the teams goals or 101%. The Vancouver blueliners numbers only support a 75% active ratio in regards to goals they are connected with.......If the Leafs and Vancouver switched bluelines the Leafs would have scored 25% less goals this year. (of course it does not work that way but if you want to look at stats this is what happens) The only thing it points out is that the Leafs defence has a lot more responbilities to win games then Vancouvers dmen do,.
The only decent goalie that the Leafs have is the Monster and in his last 4 starts this season.... his regulation (*****NOTE regulation) goals against average is 2.25 goals. You have to rememeber that in those 5 games he played three of them in overtime! With any kind of scoring depth such as a team like Vancouver would have there would not have been any over time in the first place. Vancouver over the last 4 games with a goalie that has almost a .050 better Save percentage gave up 1.75 goals per game of that same stretch for regulation only.
Clearly when we are comparing apples to apples the Leafs blueline is in on 100% of the teams goals vs. Vancouvers 75%. Vancouver has a slight edge over the last 4 games during regulation time in Goals against and they have a goalie that has the save percentage being .050 points higher then Toronto's goalie which could be a pretty good reason why there Goals against is lower. If I looked at the last 4 games offensive production from the blueline I bet Toronto's defenders were in on more goals % wise then Vancouvers defenders were. I know that in the Last 4 games Kaberle got 7 points all by himself.......
There is certain thoughts with regards to analysing a blueline that can not be done with stats.........that is my point. It is not that I think Vancouvers blueline is not good clearly they are. However thus far this year they have gotten better goaltending in front of it as well. Put Toskala in net for your last 6 starts and see what happens.
Posted on 11/6 1:23 PM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Kaberle without a question or hestitation is the better offensive dman. He is actively involved in on 55% of the teams goals this year. Ehrhoff by comparison is closer to 25%. That is a huge swing......
Again if offensively it cannot be conceded that Kaberle is hands down better offensively then anyone on the Nucks I fail to see the point of the debate. Not to be rude but there is no other one area of the defencemens game that can so easily be determined.
Now as to whom is the more well rounded defender I would agree with you.........but that being said Offensive dmen are a huge benefit to any team in the right numbers.
Posted on 11/6 1:30 PM | IP: 76.75.95.232
I'll give you credit, you are consistent in your defense of Kaberle...
Ehrhoff has had a very, very strong start to the season and frankly the 17 games I have watched him play this year is pretty much all I have seen of him..
I wonder how much you have watched him play this season?...
I think we can agree that the Nucks have more offensive options on the power play and in situations where they need an offensive push, which is another way of saying Kaberle has had more time on the ice in scoring situations ...
And Kaberle has scored almost all of his points on the power play and most of those points are assists while Ehrhoff has scored 11 goals to Kaberle's 6 over the past 2 seasons...
Actually, I had a quick look at their historical stats and they are very similar...
Whether you are right or I am right doesn't really matter because I think the difference from the offensive side is slim at best...
Take care...
Posted on 11/6 4:30 PM | IP: 99.199.174.104
If it was last season I would agree with you that it was a close comparison. Kaberle had his worst NHL season last year...let me repeat his very worst hockey season. I dont know why. Perhaps it was because he was dis-enchanted with the team admist all the trade rumours. I dont know...
In the off season last year Wilson and Kaberle had a conversation/meeting and the details of that meeting were that Wilson wanted Kaberle to get in shape and work out and regain his love for the game. This is something that Kaberle has never done in his career. So Kaberle decided to take the team up on it and worked out in the off season and he put on 5 lbs of muscle and he scored the highest VO2 levels on the team at training camp. This is something that was also new for him. This represented a huge improvement for Kaberle and cannot be understated.
Kablere has played in 15 games this season (after his re-birth and re-dedication to hockey). I wonder how many games you have watched him play this year?
As to Ehrhoff I have seen him play in San Jose maybe about 6-10 games a year over the last 2-3 years. I have only seen him play in maybe 4-5 games this year with Vancouver. I will take another look at him as I believe that you would not be as strong in your defence of him if there wasn't something there. Im pretty sure I know the answer to the question but I will take another look and do it objectively with a new pair of eyes and get back to you.
Statically speaking however......Kaberle has scored 11 goals twice in his career where as Ehrhoff has never accomplished this feat. In fact Ehrhoff's best was 8 goals. Kaberle has also scored 67 points in a season where as Erhoff's best year was 42 points in a season. In fact Kaberle has scored over 52 points in a season 3 times in his career. Ehrhoff is currently on pace to score 54 points this season and come close to Kaberle's 3rd best point totals where as Kaberle is currently on pace to score 98 points this year and shatter his career best of 67 points in a season.
I also agree that Vancouver may have a bit more offensive balance then the Toronto's defence corp thus Kaberle's main job on Toronto is to be the offence force from the blueline.... however the Vancouver team in General has played 3 more games then Toronto this year and Vancouver has scored 15 more goals then Toronto. To me this means that Erhoff's chances of recording a point should be higher as he is on a better offensive team then Kaberle. The reason why Kaberle has so many points on the PP is simple. Most of Toronto's goals have come on the PP (a lot of credit has to go to Kaberle for this feat as he is the pp QB) however Kaberle's odds of getting a point at regular stregth go way down as the Toronto team does not score that much at even strength. If the team was better in front of Kaberle at scoring on even strength I bet you Kaberle would have another 3-7 points already this season. But that would be based on speculation and an educated guess.....
I think the numbers are staggering (the differences in regards to projections on Ehrhoff's first 18 games and Kaberle's first 15 games.
Kaberle on pace for 98 points
Ehrhoff on pace for 54 points
But I said I would take a second look and put point totals asside and look at as objectively as I can and I will do that.
Posted on 11/9 6:19 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
Sorry Shakes - I re-read my post and you're right - I didn't actually say Kaberle was the best offensively of all of them - I agree he is.
He's also really, really bad defensively - I won't use stats to back up my argument, just my own personal thoughts - he gets pushed over in the corners consistently, he misses stick checks consistently, his positioning is very poor and he's not strong on the man in front of the net.
I disagree that Vancouver scores more goals therefore Ehrhoff should have more chance to score than Kaberle - Kaberle plays almost 2 and half minutes more per game than Ehrhoff, who also only plays on the 2nd PP unit - Kaberle is really the only offensive d-man on the Leafs which means Wilson rides him when they have a chance to score. That being said, I also think Kaberle is better offensively than Ehrhoff so I disagree with Rikster.
Ehrhoff is better defensively, though he's not spectacular IMHO - he's middle of the road or slightly better than that. Yes, I do think Kaberle is that bad defensively - like top 10 worst in the NHL bad - he just can't play any defensive game at all IMHO.
I'll do the same though Shakes - I'll watch Kaberle as objectively as I can this season (I've watched 4 Leaf games if I recall correctly) and give you my thoughts - perhaps he's improved and I just haven't noticed.
Posted on 11/9 10:58 AM | IP: 203.18.176.243
To help you out.........and something to note.
Kaberle is playing the entire PP most of the time. Depending on how it shaped up and how much energy he excerted. That is why his conditioning and VO2 levels were so important that he improved upon them. This allows Wilson to play him for the full 2 minutes on the PP. On the PK Kaberle gets limited ice time (sometimes he plays but really he is not there go to guy) that is why his time on ice minutes do not look out of whack. The PP time is offseting his lack of PK time. Which is good as it is maximizing his potential. In fact Kaberle is much stronger this year with his skating as well and Toronto now has Stempniak (forward) playing on the top PP unit on the point with Kaberle....Wison must really trust Kaberle...
Kaberle is not close to a top 10 worst in the NHL defensively. LOL! (good one) His skating is far to good. You rarely see him get burned in front of the net anymore either......In fact there is no glarring weakness's to his game. Maybe the Vancouver fans are just used to the big boy defenders. (LOL!)
You can say Ehrhoff only gets second line PP minutes in Vancouver but I can guarantee you that Kaberle would get first ine PP minutes if he was there.......so to me that is a mute point.
I will be okay with a re-visit/re-look. Kind of looking forward to it.
Posted on 11/9 11:15 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
I'll have a look Shakes - Kaberle was top 10 worst in the NHl defensively last year (IMHO of course) - I'll be as unbiased as I can be and give you my thoughts after the next game I have the time to watch.
Posted on 11/9 2:26 PM | IP: 203.18.176.243
I had to smile when you asked how many games I've watched the Leafs play cause that question could get you lynched on the West Coast...
Of course the answer is how many Saturdays have there been since the start of the season?...:)
Interesting that Dan Boyle had more points on a bad Tampa Bay team than he did on a good San Jose team...
Interesting that Kyle Wellwood had twice the amount of points for the Leafs than he had in his first season in Vancouver....
I think you know where I am going with this...
I'll join you and Die Hard in paying particular attention to both players over the next few games...
Take care....
Posted on 11/9 4:47 PM | IP: 99.199.174.104
Tomas Kaberle = Sandis Ozolinsh without the beer ;)
Kabs career numbers are a notch below Ozo's but like comparing Erhoff, the team has a lot to do with it.
The thing I find curious though is Leafs have never been able to trade him. Other teams have had no trouble moving "specialist" Dmen. Campbell, Pitiken and Visnovsky spring to mind as recent examples.
Posted on 11/9 5:39 PM | IP: 75.128.51.39
Interesting to note that Kaberle got 67 points on a good team that went to the semi finals in what is thus far characterized as his career year........where as on last years stinky team his points were way down and would be classified as his worst year. Kaberle has got points on a good and a bad team....
Dan Boyle seems to be doing pretty good on a good San Jose team this year. In fact I think he is in second for scoring from defenders behind Kaberle of course :) I think injuries kind of hurt Boyle in San Jose early on. But remember Boyle did well on a good Tampa team as well thus negating your point of reference. Boyle did good on a bad Tampa team, Boyle did good on a good tampa team, he did bad on a good San Jose team initially, and is CURRENTLY rebounding and doing good on a good san jose team. Confused yet? Point being playing on a good or bad team with Boyle as well as Kaberle had no bearing on his sucess.
Kyle Wellwood was booted out of Toronto for being out of shape so your going to get vicious point total differences when a player is in shape at the peak of his career/confidence, then gets injured and then gets out of shape and then comes back. Not a good player to pick an example from as the out of shape/injury thing cause to many swings in point totals + his ice time minutes can be hugely impacted on a poor team vs. a good team as he can get 2nd line minutes on a poor team and 3rd line minutes on a good team. Top 4 defenders get top 4 defender minutes. Bubble 2nd/3rd/AHL players get minutes all over the map.
I understand what your saying and in some cases I can agree. But with the examples provided I do not see the fit......
From the sounds of it you might want to keep it a secret that your scouting Kaberle.......LOL!
Posted on 11/10 7:25 AM | IP: 76.75.95.232
The Leafs did not have trouble trading him two years ago in fact they were offered a beatiful deal. They had a deal in place for Carter + a 1st for Kaberle.......Fletcher went to close the deal and Kaberle invoked his NMC and nixed the deal. Only last year did Burke have trouble moving Kaberle during his worst year in the NHL...........mostly because he was asking for the similar price to be paid as the year previously even though Kaberle was coming off of a bad season.
I doubt very much the Leafs will have any trouble moving him (if they want to and or if Kaberle allows them to move him) this year if he continues to lead all NHL blueliners in points.
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that the Leafs are deeper on the back end than Vancouver for a few reasons - one is that the Leafs have a more expensive D corps than Vancouver which means they can't upgrade up front as much, two is that any team with Jeff Finger in your top 7 is not a deep team defensively, and three is that the Leafs simply give up way more opportunities than the Nucks do - and it's not all due to bad defence by the forwards.
FYI I just wanted to put in a cool emotioncon and I liked that one .....nothing meant by it.